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About this episode

What happened to our sex life? It’s a question that so many couples and individuals ask themselves in silence, often with a mix of confusion, frustration, and vulnerability. Desire seems to disappear overnight. Intimacy becomes awkward or routine. Shame and self-doubt creep in, making it all the harder to talk about what’s really going on—let alone figure out how to reconnect. The problem isn't just about mismatched libido or busy schedules. It's about navigating the invisible scripts, societal expectations, stress, and even past wounds that shape our most intimate experiences.

In this episode, we dive deep into understanding the roots of sexual disconnection and desire discrepancies–from personal identity and past experiences to relational habits and cultural messaging. Through empathetic discussion and expert insights, the conversation invites listeners to explore both individual and relational factors that impact their sex lives, offering practical strategies for reclaiming intimacy, self-awareness, and genuine pleasure. Whether you’re looking to rekindle passion, start new conversations, or simply better understand your own needs, this episode delivers compassionate tools and supportive perspectives to help you navigate the complex terrain of modern sexual relationships.

Dr. Kate Balestrieri is the author of What Happened to My Sex Life? and a licensed psychologist and certified sex therapist focused on helping people heal from trauma and addiction, improve relationships, and have better sex lives. She is the founder of Modern Intimacy, a counseling practice that operates in Los Angeles, Miami, and Chicago, and a passionate advocate for mental health, relational and sexual health, and wellness.

Episode Highlights

03:08 Kate’s personal and clinical journey exploring lost desire.

08:46 How identity and culture influence sexual expression.

11:32 Confronting fear and questioning sexual norms.

15:12 Creating safety to discuss and explore new desires.

18:39 Building safety and self-awareness around intimacy.

20:56 Unpacking shame, fantasies, and compulsive sexual behavior.

26:17 Understanding that fluctuating desire is normal.

29:04 The impact of stress and lifestyle on libido.

31:22 Prioritizing self-care and space for intimacy.

35:04 Practicing rolling consent and daily connection.

37:51 Rethinking gender roles in intimacy.

40:03 Addressing resentment and rebuilding honesty.

44:04 Healing, self-compassion, and claiming pleasure.

Your Check List of Actions to Take

• Take a moment of pause regularly to connect with your breath and tune into your body, which helps build presence and emotional awareness.
• Spend time exploring your own sexual identity, beliefs, and permission structures—ask yourself, “Who am I?” when it comes to desire and pleasure.
• Consider what factors (personal, relational, or societal) might be influencing your current relationship to sex. Journal about what feels alive, shut down, or confusing.
• Practice sharing your needs, wants, and concerns with your partner(s) using curious, non-judgmental language—invite them to do the same.
• Identify small, safe ways to take new risks in your sexual or emotional intimacy, “stretching” a bit outside your comfort zone.
• Schedule regular self-care or solo “me time” to recharge and reconnect with your own body and pleasure, even if it’s just 15 minutes a day.
• Intentionally set aside time for intimacy with your partner. Focus on connection, touch, or shared pleasure rather than a specific sexual outcome.
• Notice any resentment, unspoken needs, or emotional blocks, and gently begin to address these. Consider support from a therapist if these feel difficult to tackle alone.

Mentioned

What Happened to My Sex Life?: A Sex Therapist’s Guide to Reclaiming Lost Desire, Connection, and Pleasure (*Amazon Affiliate link) (book)

Get Naked with Dr. Kate (*Apple Podcast) (podcast)

Relationship Map To Happy, Lasting Love

Connect with Dr. Kate Balestrieri

Websites: modernintimacy.com

Facebook: facebook.com/themodernintimacy

YouTube: youtube.com/channel/UClA2nKs0kZyeInZctBNCUqw

Instagram: instagram.com/themodernintimacy

Connect with Dr. Jessica Higgins

Facebook: facebook.com/EmpoweredRelationship 

Instagram: instagram.com/drjessicahiggins 

Podcast: drjessicahiggins.com/podcasts/

Pinterest: pinterest.com/EmpowerRelation 

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/drjessicahiggins 

Twitter: @DrJessHiggins 

Website: drjessicahiggins.com  

Email: [email protected]

If you have a topic you would like it to be discussed, please contact us by clicking on the “Ask Dr. Jessica Higgins” button here. 

Thank you so much for your interest in improving your relationship. 

Also, I would so appreciate your honest rating and review. Please leave a review by clicking here. 

Thank you!  

*With Amazon Affiliate Links, I may earn a few cents from Amazon, if you purchase the book from this link.

Episode Transcript

Dr. Kate, thank you for joining us.

Thanks so much for inviting me.

I am looking forward to our conversation. I feel like you have so much to offer with your background and training and personal experience, which I know you'll be sharing a little bit about, just what prompted you to really be focusing on this specific area. But where would you like to start, just for people who are getting to know you?

Well, I think maybe the Cliffs Notes. I'm a licensed psychologist, a certified sex therapist, certified sex addiction therapist, and I own a therapy practice called Modern Intimacy with providers across the country.

Wonderful. So with your topic today around What Happened to My Sex Life, I know this is a title of your recent book, and just really looking and addressing the questions that people may be asking themselves in private when they notice that they are not feeling the same sexually in their sexual intimacy, whether or not it's just their individual experience, and/or how they're relating to others. How did this become of interest to really focus on this specifically?

Yeah, so I am a sex therapist, and talking about desire discrepancies and people's lost connection with their desire is an everyday conversation for me. So I definitely, through research and certainly clinical practice, observe many themes that separate people from their desire. But therapists are not immune to the human condition, and I found myself asking the question: what happened to my sex life? When it became clear to me that it had become really deprioritized, and that was really curious and it was a big shift for me. So it started the process of compiling, of course some personal exploration in my own world, but really a more intentional understanding of what those themes are that maybe are more prevalent, but less talked about. So my book is a conversation that people might be having with themselves about trying to understand the intrinsic factors, the relational factors that can be creating some distance between themselves and desire.

Yes, thank you for speaking to that. I so agree. Just that I have had so many people ask me about my own experiences as it relates to any type of challenges. I'm like, I get scared, I get freaked out, or my stomach sickens and knots. I just trust the process because I have more research or understanding about the landscape of some of these things. But it doesn't make me insulated from these challenges. I also really appreciate, Kate, that in your book, just even the context of what you're really inviting people to consider, just even how they identify as far as sexuality, and just really giving room and space for a continuum, getting out of the binary heteronormative frame. I mean, I very much am in support of men's development, women's development, and the healthy acknowledging of both of these, and also just some of the cultural messaging that exists. It's really interesting to spend time to reflect on all the different layers and variables that impact our access to our sexual selves.

I appreciate you saying that. I think probably one of the most important but least sexy chapters in my book is the chapter, Who Am I, where I talk a lot about identity and the intersectionality of the identities that we maintain, and how they can influence our relationship with sexuality, our relationship with desire. Because so much of it is about permission. If I belong to this group, and this group is saying that I have to show up in this way, then can I be sexual in a way that maybe competes with that identity's requirements, or the things that are important to me about that identity? This is a very unconscious process that most of us have not taken the time to really deconstruct and understand about ourselves. But it is a fundamentally important permission-giving place to start when people are maybe feeling like shame is one of the bigger impediments to their desire.

Absolutely, thank you. Even if one is aware and has done some level of inquiry, it still perhaps can show up and operate and be running interference. Because real desire, I think you speak about this, is real connection to what feels real and true, and having space to own that and be embodied in it. I will just say, I know this affects a lot of people, that whether or not it's what is seen in a movie that could be very classic archetypes as far as sexual relating, or people watching porn, or whatever they're accessing to get visuals or information around what sexual intimacy can be. I mean, we're social animals, so this understanding and learning or curiosity in what are other people doing, I think that's just a natural part of development. And that can also be put on us. Like, when you talk about the patriarchal structure, and I think you reference some of the history around the masculine feminine, if we're going to look at a heterosexual relationship, heteronormative. I see this show up even now in my sessions with couples, where the female partner will say: Oh, it's just kind of like, got to do the duty. I'm just like, ah. So it's really profound how much this shows up in what roles that we adopt or scripts. I mean, it's complicated.

It is, and it's mostly unconscious.

Because the systems of power that exist that maintain these different systems, naming patriarchy of course, people do experience social consequences sometimes when they challenge those things. There are a lot of positives that come with it too, and it is not all good or all bad, as nothing really is. But it can be scary for people to really start to peel back the questions of why do I think this way? Do I really need this to feel safe? Is it okay for me to think about my sexuality or my gender or other elements of my identity in a way that maybe aren't so prescribed? Again, the liberation and the fear that come with that play a big role in how we shape our sexual Yes and our No.

Thank you for speaking to the fear that's often associated with challenging some of these scripts or things that we've adopted along the way, that may have been unconscious up until a certain point, or even the relational. That it can challenge, will I still be lovable if I say no or I ask for something that sounds really arousing? That is unknown, uncharted territory, especially if we have no previous experience to draw from.

Yeah, it can be really scary, and that fear can shut a lot of people down.

So I know we'll probably get into that, because you really give some structure to helping people be able to find themselves. Not that it's just one contributing factor, and I know this is partly how your book is structured, is the first part is really looking at what might be operating in me or what might be happening individually. Second, relationally, and then what do we do about it? But my question just popped up around fear, around how to negotiate taking safe risks. So taking a risk, but doing it in a safe way that we don't get totally paralyzed? I would love to hear more about that, but do you want to save that?

Yeah, whenever. We can talk about it now or later, it's up to you.

Well, I would love to hear any thoughts, just bigger picture. Just how you might approach somebody who feels the fear, but also is wanting to get outside of things that maybe keep them in these set ways.

Well, I think there's a few variables to consider. One, people do have real ecological concerns. If I ask for this thing and it isn't acceptable in my partnership and the partnership doesn't survive this, what happens to me? So I think people have to do a bit of an assessment, a bit of an inventory: what kind of risks are they willing to take, what kinds of rewards are worth those risks? I can't answer that for anyone individually. That has to be a process that they explore on their own. Because what might feel really safe and tolerable for one person might feel completely intolerable for another. So there really isn't a cookie-cutter way to answer that question. But in my book, I outline a process of thinking about what is safe enough. Because in order to grow, in order to expand, in order to feel, we have to be willing to tolerate a little bit of discomfort. Because there is a stretching process, a growing process, a learning process.

Sometimes when you're asking for what you want or need, whether it's sexual or otherwise, there's a little bit of ambiguity when you're negotiating that with yourself or with a partner about, are we going to get to a place where we're all okay with this and where it makes sense and where we can fit this new dimension into a partnership that may feel otherwise wonderful, or maybe full of tension in some places? So there's negotiation that happens. I find that when partners are able to be transparent and give each other the benefit of the doubt, and to ask questions about what about this new thing that you want to explore, what does that do for you and how does that serve our relationship? That can be a really beautiful starting point in a shared curiosity that might create less defensiveness and might create more understanding of why this new kink, for example, could actually be beneficial for your partnership, even if it's not your partner's total jam.

Maybe they're like: Oh, I get that it does this for you and it helps you feel alive in these ways, and that actually nurtures our partnership. Because you might show up with more energy or more autonomy or more this or more that, and that actually is beneficial. So I want that for you and I want that for us. If people are really afraid to ask the question of what do you get to learn about yourself if we explore this or that, they really lose out on a lot of opportunity for deeper connection.

I'm grateful you're modeling or just giving an example to some curious language and just having a starting place that can feel very open. Just let's wonder, here's what I notice, and what are possibilities. I very much appreciate you helping people access, what would that allow me to feel? That could be more visible to the other, in that, perhaps as you said, it wouldn't be that particular idea or position or style is necessarily my preference, and hearing what it means to you or what it allows you to feel. That I have interest in, and maybe there's a way that I can participate that feels really genuine and exciting for me. These conversations, again, it's uncharted territory, we don't know where it's going to go. But to be able to hold some room and give some opportunity for development and growth, it's quite special, and I'm also aware that it requires something. Even though you're saying a starting point, I'm imagining it requires some of the individual inquiry and really acknowledging self, and then also looking at relationally. Like, do we even have the ability to have these conversations? Do we even need to start smaller to just build some repetition around how we can confront topics that feel sensitive?

Well, this can be really tricky, especially if one or both partners maybe doesn't have a lot of emotional regulation skills. We can quickly get flooded, and that can make conversations that are charged dangerous to have, emotionally and sometimes otherwise. But it is really important to think about like, how do you introduce something in a way that brings a win-win to your dynamic? Sometimes that win-win isn't always clear, and it isn't always a linear path. But it doesn't mean that it isn't mutually beneficial in some way if you are in partnership. Now, if you're an unpartnered person and you're exploring things, that's a whole different negotiation with yourself and with different partners that you might have.

So I think the thing to maybe remember is that we do get to experience self-development in whatever way is important to us. For many people, sex is the vehicle for that. Because sex becomes a bit of play, it becomes a metaphor, and it gives us access to parts of ourselves that we don't necessarily get to experience in other parts of our lives. So when a lot of folks are coming in and they feel shame around wanting to try something new, I immediately remind them that your fantasies don't define your worthiness as a human. Your fantasies are a path to feel something. So let's figure out what you want to feel, and then maybe see how you feel about that.

Well, thank you for acknowledging that. I'm hearing something pop for me that sounds a little bit like playing devil's advocate. I'm not, I very much understand where you're at and subscribe wholeheartedly. I just hear the voice around, well, if somebody's coming in with shame or they notice some compulsive or addictive tendencies, I guess that does fit. I guess it takes some unpacking, like what part is really congruent with who they are and what they want, and also, are they using it as a coping strategy? Talk to me a little bit about how this fits.

Yeah, so I'm glad you're bringing this up. Because this is a really, I think, gray area, murky area for folks, especially if they are experiencing what they describe as compulsivity or out of control sexual fantasies or behavior. Sometimes people feel shame around the frequency with which they are engaging in the sexualized thoughts or behavior, and sometimes they feel shame around what it is they're fantasizing about or what it is they're doing. So it is important to get a deeper understanding of where that shame lives and the function that it serves for that person.

But I think it's really important that we don't attach any pathology to the kind of sex that people like. Understanding, of course, that it is consensual behavior. But outside of that, really, when most folks are experiencing shame or compulsivity, it's because they're having a hard time stopping and they want to, or they think the amount of sex that they're having is not okay. So sometimes there might be real ecological consequences in their lives. But sometimes people have a lot of shame that they're sexual at all, or they have a sex life with themselves, maybe separate from the sex life with their partner. So really, we're not talking about compulsivity. We're talking about folks who maybe don't have clear fidelity agreements, or maybe they have differences in what they want their fidelity agreements to be, and there is an unwillingness to adhere to those fidelity agreements, or a lack of honesty in setting them up in the first place. And somebody is having a sexual relationship with themselves or with porn or with other people that doesn't align with the things they've agreed to. So there's a lot of nuance here that needs to be very carefully untangled.

Yes, and I hear the caution of putting any label on somebody's experience or how they're operating. Tell me if I'm hearing you right, and this is what I'm associating, that if the question can be asked around, what would you love if we took the shame off and you really looked at what you would love or what feels wonderful to you? That's a great thing to give some room for, because that could then perhaps look at ways in which they're cutting off certain parts of themselves, or they feel as though I have to keep this hidden or it's not acceptable. Or how they're owning really in their own space with whoever they want to share with, and then also themselves. That seems like a big component to what you're describing.

Yeah, a lot of folks are trying to fit themselves like square pegs into round holes. So coming back to my chapter on Who Am I, we have all been exposed to primarily a heteronormative and mono-normative culture. And what that means is that most folks have grown up believing that monogamy is the healthy and predetermined path for people. But what we understand about human behavior is that pre-patriarchy, that was actually not the case.

So what we have is a lot of folks who have been subjected to compulsory monogamy. They've entered into monogamous relationships because that has been the prescribed trajectory for them, what they believe to be “normal and true” for healthy relationships. In fact, maybe their actual nature is non-monogamous. So the square peg round hole, that's going to be a really difficult situation for someone, for partners in a dynamic like that. So here's an opportunity to say what actually is my truth, and can we create agreements that sustain us and our needs together, if you're partnered?

That's with, not assumption, but the hope that maybe somebody has a little bit more clarity. But to your earlier point, some of this can be unconscious. So to even look at, what am I finding myself gravitating towards, or where do I get excited, or if I'm shutting down certain parts of myself or making it not okay or having a lot of shame about it? This is super helpful.

So in your first part of your book, you're referencing who am I as a big question, and you spend time on it and you've talked about it here today. You also talk about am I broken, or just is something wrong with me? That being a very common question, and I can tell you how many people have asked me. The level of their sexual frequency, is that normal? Just feeling like they're questioning, and these internal wonderings around how am I existing and how is that? Do you want to speak to that here?

Yeah, absolutely. I think probably the most common question that I get as a sex therapist is some iteration of: am I normal, or am I broken, or am I wrong, or am I bad? Something along that line, and it comes up in so many ways. It comes up when people are curious about the fantasies that they have. Am I normal? Do other people like this? Is this okay to like? Am I in trouble?

So there's that component. But as it relates to desire, a lot of time when people have very natural ebbs and flows in their desire, they'll ask the question of, am I broken? Because there's maybe a desire discrepancy between themselves and their partner. Sometimes the higher desire partner has this fear of like: Oh no, am I too much? Do I want too much? Am I wrong? Am I flawed? Am I bad? Sometimes the lower desire feels that way. Am I broken because I don't want to have sex as much and it's not a big priority for me right now? So it's a big fear.

The thing that I really hope people listening might take away, is that desire does ebb and flow. For some people, sure it might remain more constant, but if yours feels more variable, that's okay. Over the course of our lifespan, there may be periods of time where you feel less interested and less motivated, or more interested and more motivated, and it's normal. Now, I hate the word normal, but to use it in this context. It's normal to have variation. Because look, we don't get hungry at the same time every day, at the same time as our partner. We're not thirsty. We don't like to do the same things all the time that our partner wants to do. So why would we expect that we get horny or want to have sex at the same time and the same frequency as another human being? We don't.

You add hormones into that, it's a miracle that people sync up at the same time with what's their internal arousal or desire.

Exactly, and you add things in like taking care of children and being the primary or the default parent, feeling touched out, or taking care of family members who are aging or maybe sick and need extra support, work demands. Our lives are constantly moving targets and they're dynamic in their domains. So our sex life will be too.

Do you find that the modern pace of life and the demands, some of which you just listed, make self-care or embodiment difficult, and thus sexual health is a part of that?

Absolutely. I think we are living through a time where we are more stressed, more digital, less well-resourced probably than ever before. The economy plays a big role in how well people can be in their body, how proactively they can be in their body, how much access to different things that might give them more rest, more pleasure. There's just so many different variables that are playing a role right now in how we do or do not relate to desire and arousal. I think the last statistic that I read on this was that about 70% of folks respond to an elevated amount of stress with decreased desire, and about 30% of folks respond to elevated stress with increased desire. So there isn't a right or wrong way. But for many folks, that increased allostatic load is a real inhibitor for desire, and for other people, it's the way they diffuse it. So there's a bifurcation in how people respond to that. But certainly, we are living busier and less resourced, less embodied lives, probably than ever before.

Yeah, thank you for acknowledging just what that can be, and then also how we might respond, which hearkens back to the diversity of how we experience things as humans. Now, when we talk about relationship, knowing that there are ebbs and flows, and then the various life events or stress that might interfere with feeling embodied or present with desire and arousal, hence affecting sexual interest. Do you recommend people make room and space and prioritize? Because I'd imagine it's a nuanced thing as well, like we've talked about, that: Oh, I'm trying to show up and be something that I'm not. But also, if I'm in a default mode and I'm in this habituated way of letting my life and the demands, and I'm not necessarily having the level of intention that maybe I want. How do you hold that?

It's a really good question.

And where do I pull that want when I'm already doing so many other things? So I think the question to really be curious about is, how big of a want is that want to want to be sexual again? Then you get to decide how much prioritization you apply to that. But for folks who do want to want it, I think scheduling time for a few things is really important. There's some back and forth about scheduling sex. I don't know that I love the idea of scheduling sex, because then it starts to feel like an obligation or something that if you don't do now, you've not done something and your to-do list gets longer.

So for folks who maybe are a bit more neurodivergent, that can start to really intersect with their demand avoidance, and it can be a huge impediment. Also, where there is maybe some sexual entitlement in a dynamic, I never would want to encourage someone to capitulate to sexual entitlement or coercion. Because that sends a very strong message to the body, and it feels like a giant no, even though you're creating a situation where you're saying yes. So it really creates more tension, and it can widen the chasm of desire discrepancy in a relationship. So I would say don't force yourself if your body is giving you a no.

But what I do love the idea of is two things. Scheduling time for you to just have your own space and self time and care. That can take any form you want. If you want to sit and stare at the wall for two hours because that's all you have energy for, do that. I love that for you. Make it easy. If you're like, I want to train for a marathon in my me time, do that then. Whatever is your thing, whatever allows you to feel like you and like you're back in your body, you're back in yourself, you're actually alive again in your own skin. That is really huge. Because we do have a lot of demands on our time, we do have a lot of expectations. For people who parent, oof those demands multiply fast and very quickly. Your body is not your own, your time is not your own, and you really do need some runway to find yourself again, and then people start to feel desire in their body. You have to actually be before you can be anything else.

You share the be. If I'm trying to share and I have no being, then it's difficult to share from that place of disconnect. I love that recommendation.

Yeah. So for people who are partnered, I often ask them, how are you setting yourselves up so that you're actually carving out time for each of you to have your own lane, your own ability to just let it all go and come back to yourself? Then, maybe scheduling time to create intimacy. Now that can mean anything. Emotional intimacy, non-sexual, physical intimacy, intellectual intimacy, maybe sexual intimacy. But I love the idea of putting that intentional time on the calendar and then letting it be what it's going to be.

Yes. I'm reminded, years ago, I interviewed Martha Kauppi and she talks about this. Do you know her?

Yeah, I know of her.

Yeah. She was talking about approaching the shared space with the intention to luxuriate, and that there's a rolling consent. We're not coming with prescribed, like this is what's going to happen. Even this yes or no, like I have to decide if I want to have intercourse or not at the start, that is unknown perhaps. Maybe my body is more in this responsive place and I don't know yet, and that I'm really allowing permission that at any point just continuing to say: Well, what feels good now, or what am I yes to? That each person, if we're talking about two people in a partnered relationship, that they're responsible for their own orgasm. This pressure to please, and I know this exists even when we know we don't want to approach it. But just really having that intention to luxuriate and have a lot of permission, that it's not decided yet what's going to happen.

Yeah, I love that. Creating opportunities where desire can build. I think when you've been with someone for a long time, sometimes you take for granted what you know about them, and it's a little bit more difficult to be intentional around cultivating desire. You live together maybe, you're around each other a lot. You do all the day-to-day things that are pretty unsexy. But really thinking like, well, what turns my partner on, what turns me on? How do we create time and space where those things can start to build, so desire feels more organic? I think a lot of folks land together and they're like: Well, now what, isn't it supposed to magically happen? No, we actually have to show up with some energy that builds that. When couples can create erotic moments throughout their day-to-day life and hold some of that tension and that energy together, then it does become more organic, more easily when you do have the time dedicated.

Absolutely. Oh gosh, just showing up, laying there, and then now what? I'm even aware that sometimes in heterosexual monogamous relationships, perhaps the male partner might feel like, or the female partner might feel like: I've been running masculine energy all day and I'm wanting you to take the lead. And they're both like: Well, you go, you lead. Because they're both exhausted. So coming to the table with a sense of connection and being of what feels good, then there's perhaps a little more to play with, and maybe one has more energy. Do you have any comment around the polarity of masculine feminine and how this shows up?

I don't use that language. That language for me is pretty dangerously patriarchal. I think folks can get stuck in an idea between energetic intention, and what are the gender roles and what's acceptable for me or not acceptable for me. So I tend to stay away from it, but I know people use it a lot. So my invitation is to maybe think about what do these polarities represent for you? If you were using the language of masculine or feminine as shorthand, do you know what you're actually saying, what you're actually calling in? Because different folks will define that differently. And what I hear a lot in partnership is, I want you to take the lead because I've been busy all day, and I don't have the capacity or the mental load to curate an erotic start. That doesn't really matter about gender. People can show up with that sort of energetic exhaustion or availability.

So maybe today, partners have more of a solidified: I like to initiate, I love when you initiate. Cool, so we know who's going to take charge most of the time. But even in those scenarios, sometimes the person who's the default initiator maybe isn't feeling it, and might really value somebody else showing up and being like: Hey, hey, hey. I tend to stay away from that language, but I think the intention is really important, to talk through. Like, what does being masculine mean? Does that mean being dominant? Okay, what does that mean, how does that show up? What are the behaviors that evidence that, and what's exciting erotically about that for one or both person, or more than two if there are more than two in the context?

Yeah, I appreciate you just even saying it can be a tricky territory to be using that language, because of what we associate. I very much believe every human has both energies, but also, for each person to define: Well, what are you, what is it that you're seeking? I love just going a little further there, because so many assumptions can be made about what that means.

So many. It does get really over-coupled with gender identity and power structures in the world, so it can be a bit of an impediment. For example, I talk with a lot of men who really, really love anal play, and they're so afraid to bring it forward to their partner who, in this context, is a woman. Because they don't want her to think that he is not heterosexual. They have a lot of fear around that. We talk a lot about what does it mean to be masculine, but also to be a human who has an anus? Because all humans have anuses. They all have lots of pleasure nerve endings and lots of pleasure and sensation potential. So can you separate that from your gender identity and your sexual orientation, and just explore anatomy and physical sensation and what is that like? So again, I don't use that shorthand for some of those reasons.

Super helpful, thank you. Well, I am acknowledging, just speaking about the relational space, that when people are a little bit more embodied or have connected with themselves, approach that shared space, more might be felt. I think you do a great job, I know we don't have a ton of time, but recognizing some of the relational dynamics. Like: Ooh, I'm actually a little bothered by you, or actually I have this little bit of a bone to pick with you. Maybe I wasn't even aware of it because I was so occupied on all the daily life, but when I really am present with you, I recognize I have some things to clear, or dynamics that I find challenging. So that can also come up or be part of what's interacting here.

For sure.

So it is maybe safer, but we unfortunately can't just numb away the hard things. When we numb away, we are numbing away the good things too. So those relationships can feel very flat after time. As I said before, in order to feel good, we have to be willing to tolerate some risk. So getting real about: You know what, I have been really resentful with you for a long time, and I need to own that. But also, can we talk about it and can we change some of this dynamic? It's sometimes necessary to get unstuck where there is a drop in desire.

Thank you for speaking to that. I just feel like it's so important, and I'm also aware. Again, I keep asking questions, but this might be my second to last or last. But this is perhaps where people might also notice the trauma, just how they're experiencing sensation or what's coming up for them that may not fit with present time circumstances or interaction, which might be related to a way in which someone is not acknowledging what's real. Like you said, I love that phrase, just the dishonest harmony. It captures it so well.

That's not my phrase, by the way. I don't know who coined it, but I learned it on TikTok and it so perfectly encapsulates conflict avoidance.

Doesn't it? It's so prevalent, to varying degrees. But what would you like to say? I know you wrote a lot about this in your book and you offer just so, so much support. But just here right now, for someone listening that might be negotiating this.

Well, I think we really want to be mindful that even a commitment to that dishonest harmony or conflict avoidance can be rooted in trauma. It might've been the thing that allowed you to survive really hard circumstances. So stay really compassionate with the parts of you that are taking care of you in the best way that they know how, while also making space for some new strategies that might actually affect a more long-term sustainable outcome for you. We have the gift of healing, and unfortunately, that requires a little bit of rolling up the sleeves and doing some of the hard work. We're ready for that when we're ready for it and not a moment sooner. So when you feel ready to lean into that growth edge in a way that you feel resourced to do it, then that's a good time to start, and let's honor the parts of you that weren't ready up until that moment. So it's never too late, and it's important that you really gauge when you feel like you have the spoons to do it.

Yeah, this is all really good information. Just less blame and shame, recognizing: Oh, perhaps I am dishonest. I mean, it's a nice phrase, but to then say I'm being dishonest, which there's truth to it, but the compassion. Just noticing it's hard for me to bring these parts, and thus there's ways in which I'm not connecting, and what is that about? Is that something I'm wanting to explore or do some work around?

Yeah, sometimes it might be helpful to think about it as a self-abandonment. Sometimes self-abandonment is the only form of self-preservation that someone's been taught in life. So the word dishonest does carry some charge, but that inauthenticity has been protective.

Absolutely, yes. Well, Dr. Kate, is there anything you wanna say here before we wrap up or add to?

Just that we all have a right to pleasure, not necessarily pleasure with another person. We all have a right to pleasure and to create a relationship with sexual and non-sexual pleasure that feels empowering and enlivening and right sized for us.

Thank you. Tell us about your book that you offer so much guidance and support to do some of this work.

Yeah, thank you. It's called What Happened To My Sex Life: A Sex Therapist's Guide to Reclaiming Lost Desire, Connection, and Pleasure. It's available everywhere you get your books, and you can also find it along with other resources on my website, ModernIntimacy.com.

Yes. Do you want to say anything else about Modern Intimacy? It sounds like you have clinicians and practitioners that serve people all over the states.

Yeah, we do. Thank you. My team is really exemplary, and we are licensed across 15 states, and we also have a few coaches who work with people internationally. We can offer services in English, Spanish, and Farsi. Everyone on my team is, in some way, shape, or form, on the path to becoming a sex therapist, um, many already are. We all really practice from a place of inclusivity and understanding people's whole selves and their gestalt. But it's a really fun team, and I feel really grateful to work with everyone on it.

Wonderful. Well, I'll make sure to have the link to your website as well as to the book. I know you mentioned, as people connect with you, that you might have other opportunities to engage in curriculum or courses. I so appreciate all that you're doing and offering people in this landscape.

Well, thank you. Thank you so much for holding space for this conversation today. It's been really lovely.