ERP 056 – Secrets To Sex Even When No One Is In The Mood
Welcome to the Empowered Relationship Podcast – helping you turn relationship challenges into opportunities and setting you up for relationship success. Your host, Dr. Jessica Higgins, is a licensed psychologist and relationship coach, who shares valuable tips, tools, and resources for you to dramatically improve your relationship.
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Dr. Jessica Higgins: Hi. Thank you for listening. Thank you for tuning in and joining me today. As always I am so thrilled to be sharing information, tools, resources, and stories with you so that you can improve your relationship. Over the last several weeks and several episodes, I have been answering listeners’ questions. So, thank you for submitting your questions. If you have submitted a question and I have not yet answered it, know that I will and I will be resuming with listeners’ questions next week. Today I’m taking a break so that I can share with you a very special interview.
My guest today has a wealth of knowledge to offer you. She is incredibly talented, gifted, and knowledgeable. She has been teaching for over 20-plus years and I’m going to introduce her more in just a moment, but I hope you enjoy this. I hope you’ll connect with her and just really glean the wisdom that she has to share.
Alison Armstrong, author, educator, and creator of the wildly acclaimed “Queen’s Code” workshop series, asked the question “What if no one is misbehaving, including you?” She explores the good reasons behind the behavior of men and women such as fundamental differences in the way we think, act, and communicate. She offers simple partnership-based solutions to improve our communication and intimacy by honoring ourselves and others. She’s known for her insight, sense of humor, and ability to articulate the human experience and predicament of gender.
Thank you, Alison, for joining us and sharing your precious time with us today.
Alison Armstrong: You’re welcome. I’m glad to be here.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Excellent. So, the topic that I chose today was “Secrets to Sex Even When No One is in the Mood.” So, I know this is an area of yours, a topic of expertise, and I would love to just give a little bit of the lay in the land with my listeners if you wouldn’t mind – just what are we talking about here?
Alison Armstrong: Sure. I don’t know about expertise… [laughs]
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Okay, okay.
Alison Armstrong: That sounds funny because even though I’ve talked to thousands of people, I have one 23-year marriage. So, this is my personal experience, and then as I’ve done with all my work, I take my personal frustration and go digging it out, like how did we get here? And I really come from the assumption that if I got here, probably a lot of other people did. I consider myself a fair representation of human beings and of women in general.
This whole business started out in my marriage, and the frustration of lining up when I was in the mood for sex and my husband was in the mood for sex, and our children were asleep. On top of that, we’re both home and not in the middle of something. So, it was just so frustrating because one of us would want to or the other would want to or we’d both want to, but the circumstances are so crazy, we’d take days to line everything up. At one point I was just like, “Can we just schedule it?”
I know my grandparents had sex every Sunday afternoon after church. After church, they’d have lunch and they would have sex. I mean that just seems smart to me, but there is this whole thing about spontaneity, and I talk to all these men about do not underestimate – actually one man said you cannot overestimate the need to perform and its effect on sex. So, man wanting to, him being in the mood, uber-important. I came up with a kind of metaphor that women having sex is like eating when she isn’t hungry, right?
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes.
Alison Armstrong: A man having sex when he’s not in the mood is not only eating when he isn’t hungry, but he has to cook, too.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right. There’s a whole added layer for sure.
Alison Armstrong: Exactly. So, he’s got a cook, he’s got to perform, and as the man said, you can’t overestimate the impact of that. He was just saying that it would be impossible to overestimate it. It’s huge. It’s big as you think it is. It’s even bigger.
So, that was how I ended up in this whole thing of wanting to untangle – how can we have this work which then led me to a bunch of different areas which I’ll let you pick from a kind of menu. It led to what are the hormones that have to do with being in the mood, what do our emotions and affinity towards each other have to do with being in the mood, and ultimately what if we scheduled sex? What if we didn’t allow wanting to have sex be the source of our sex life? What if we had something else be the source of our sex life and what could that be? A whole bunch of excitement down that route, so wherever you want to go next, you should tell me.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Every time you mentioned one, I was like, “That sounds good.” But you sold me on the last one really because I think some of what I talked about on this podcast is helping people open up their mind and their mindset to possibility. And so if you’re inviting people to think about connecting sexually and the way to do that, the approach around that, I’d love to hear your thoughts on that.
Alison Armstrong: Sure. Let’s start there and there’s a bit of the first part that has to be woven in because, unfortunately, as individuals and as couples, when things aren’t the way that we picture they should be, we usually go to some version of what’s wrong with me, what’s wrong with them, what’s wrong with us. And as you know, in your work, that just goes right down into the toilet. And my suggestion is, what if there’s nothing wrong with you, or them, or the two of you together? What if there’s other things at work?
One of the things that is heavily at work is our hormones. Our levels of estrogen and testosterone, and progesterone and oxytocin, have a huge effect on just the desire to have sex – being horny, if you will, that there’s a physical impulse driving our choices. And so, hormones are something to understand, to respect, to maybe do something about. I spend a fair amount of time teaching men and women about building testosterone because we both need to do that. A major way that we build testosterone is by resting.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Is that what they say, their study is about the value of men watching sports on TV, like there’s something in that process that’s actually really beneficial or that’s different?
Alison Armstrong: Well, it depends. It depends on how they’re watching the sport. They could be building testosterone if they’re spending testosterone if they’re totally into it. Both are good. It’s really healthy to build and then spend, and build and then spend, and build and then spend. That’s like the way to go.
Women also need to pay attention to building testosterone. It’s a source of our energy and our sex drive. The thing that’s just not worked on enough is if you’re not sleeping well and you’re not resting, you’re not stopping and just sitting on your butt. You’re not going to end up with a sex drive.
So, both men and women need to do nothing and men are much better at doing nothing. Women are terrible at doing nothing.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right.
Alison Armstrong: It’s how our brain works, and if a man is doing nothing, a woman will usually try to get him to stop doing nothing.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Unless they’re on vacation or something.
Alison Armstrong: Right. And in her mind there’s so much to be done –”Get up off the couch and do something” – which is why I teach men to never tell a woman that they’re doing nothing. If she says, “What are you doing?” his job is to say, “I’m building testosterone.”
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Nice.
Alison Armstrong: Yeah. So, that’s really important. Resting is really important. Doing nothing is really important. Sleep is really important. It’s the source of the morning soldier standing in attention because rest produces testosterone which produces erections.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes.
Alison Armstrong: And then on the other hand, we have to pay attention to building oxytocin, which most of the studies are on spending oxytocin. Women need to build oxytocin or else they wouldn’t want to have sex, they’ll dread having sex, they’ll be depressed from having sex, and they will build up orgasms. And our lifestyles used to naturally produce oxytocin; and now they don’t – at all.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: I’m sure you’ll go into great depth about this. Can you give us a little sneak into one of the ways women can build oxytocin in their life?
Alison Armstrong: Yes. The trick is rhythmic hand motions but slow. You can’t be in a hurry. If you’re in a hurry, you’re now in a masculine, produce-a-result hunter mode. So, you have to slow down. It’s more of that look out the window, contemplative handwashing of dishes, or wiping down the counters in your kitchen, or you’ve been vacuuming or dusting, crocheting, knitting. You can even just try this, Jessica. Just rub your hands together, like you don’t even have to have a dish in your hand, you can just pretend you have a dish in your hand.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yeah, even when you’re describing it, Alison, I could feel the big difference between fiery exertion, a lot of effort and fast, rather than just being more embodied and flowy and just enjoying – yeah, I can feel it for sure.
Alison Armstrong: Yeah. So, you can – I mean if you want to, just when you’re sitting on plane or even watching television, just have your left hand as the plate you’re going around in circles, and then your right hand is the plate. You don’t have to produce any result. It’s just rhythmic hand motions. So, that produces oxytocin and that will increase a woman’s desire to have sex and responsiveness to sex.
But my point of where the third item that you wanted me to talk about is instead of like working on your hormones so that you want to have sex, “Okay, I want to, you want to, let’s do it,” I would rather flip it. I would rather flip that we actually plan on sex and even schedule sex often enough for what it provides for us. Because sex provides for us physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually. It does that for both men and women individually and then sex provides for the relationship.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes.
Alison Armstrong: It provides so much for the relationship. It’s a primary way that men connect is through sex. If they don’t get to have sex, they feel very disconnected from their partner. So many men have talked about that they literally connect to the world through their partners, so they connect to her, which then connects them to everybody else. Yeah, the emotional and spiritual benefits of sex for men are something that most women are really clueless about because we were so imprinted by their physical need at a young age. So, if you take the benefits of sex, anything that has great benefit you probably schedule, right? Do you just exercise when you feel like it–
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right.
Alison Armstrong: –or do you do it for the benefit? And so, the trick is to schedule it and then because it’s scheduled, then you cause yourself to want it. So, you don’t schedule it based on wanting; you schedule it based on what it provides. And then knowing, “Okay, it’s Sunday afternoon, we’re going to have sex. It’s Wednesday night, we’re going to have sex. So I’m going to slow down today, I’m going to take it easy, I’m going to go do these dishes with plenty of time. I might take a nap.” And what we’ve seen hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of women have validated this – is that if they know that they’re going to have sex, they have an appointment for sex.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes.
Alison Armstrong: They will mentally and emotionally and even physically prepare themselves. It makes foreplay just fun. Foreplay is like you got to get me in the mood. I’m in the mood, now let’s have fun. I’ve literally caused myself to want it.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: I love what you’re saying. Yes, because then it’s like your first – I want to highlight a couple of things that you’re saying. I think they’re so important. So, if you’re talking about the men’s perspective to need to perform, so then when you guys sync up and then the woman hasn’t done any of the anticipation or even getting herself in the physical space, the heart space, and ready for sex, then it’s like he’s got this added effort of how to turn her on, which can feel like an amazing hurdle.
And so, I love what you’re describing. I think it’s so key. I also love what you were saying earlier about if you’re feeling like you’re not in the mood, that doesn’t have to be a bad thing, it doesn’t have to be a threat, it doesn’t have to be something’s bad or wrong. It’s more of how do you work with your physiological state and your body and your hormones to improve and activate the hormones that support the sexual connection, the sexual feeling.
So, it’s a much more supportive, positive cycle that you’re inviting people to see as a possibility, and I love that.
Alison Armstrong: I want to jump off of something you said, Jessica, because it’s even more significant than what you said and what you said was important, and that is when a couple gets together, if she hasn’t taken the time and mental and maybe even physical space like a bubble bath for example to take care of herself and cause herself to be receptive, then he’s not dealing with someone at zero that he can turn on. That would be awesome, right? Most men are dealing with women coming to bed at a deficit.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: My gosh, yes.
Alison Armstrong: So, there’s so much work just to get her to receptivity. And besides that being a lot of effort which men have never shied away from ever, unfortunately how a man interprets that is he takes it personally. So, what he thinks is, “She doesn’t want me.” And unfortunately or fortunately, depending on how you look at it, a woman’s desire for a man is what causes his ability to perform.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right.
Alison Armstrong: So, he will suffer an inability to perform that he will think there’s something wrong with him because when he was 16, it didn’t matter how interested she seemed to be or not, right?
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right.
Alison Armstrong: But now at 45 or 35 or 55, her wanting him is everything. And so he may have an ED moment that he thinks there’s something wrong with him, but all it was was that she didn’t want him. She wasn’t “Give it to me, baby.” And then what happens is it’s just awful, Jessica. So, she’s just like moderate or not at all in her interest. Even though he really wants to have sex, he can’t produce an erection in the face of her lack of enthusiasm. Then the first time this happens, she’s like “Oh, no,” because she’s seen this on TV. “He must feel terrible. Oh, no.”
And so then, she never wants him to feel bad again, so from then on when she really does want to have sex, she doesn’t tell him. She doesn’t go, “I got to have you, baby” because she’s afraid that if he’s not able to perform again that he’ll feel bad and she doesn’t want to make him feel bad. So instead of being “Oh, I hope we can really do it because I’ve been thinking about you all day and I’m so horny.” Instead she’s, “Well, I want to if you want to, but don’t worry if you don’t want to.” And then he can’t.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: I know. It’s awful and I’m like having all these other thoughts about she could even take that as, “Well, he doesn’t really want me” and then feeling insecure and feeling bad, and then she’s distancing and he’s feeling the distance, and it’s just this negative cycle.
Alison Armstrong: Yes.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: And you turn on the TV and there’s this interesting thing that on TV we get to see, usually people getting hot and heavy and it’s happening so quickly. Like they’re kissing, and then it’s just like everybody’s ready to go and it’s just happening. And so, it’s very little display. You’re describing usually they say what – 20 minutes for a woman to really get aroused, and even if she’s coming at a neutral place. If she’s running a deficit and feeling stressed and really in her head, it’s so – the more we’re talking about it, I’m just like it’s amazing we have sex at all.
Alison Armstrong: Yeah. I hope that people– I’m making it feel doomed about this, but what I would wish for people is that you actually can feel hopeful that it’s not personal. That there’s a lot of factors and so it’s something to be in partnership about, it’s something to be proactive, and then schedule and take care of each other, support each other in doing what you need to bring yourself to that. And then what I encourage people to have for anybody – it’s so funny, Jessica, when I talk to coed groups about erectile dysfunction. And there’s these guys that have this look on their face like “that has to do with somebody else, not me.”
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes.
Alison Armstrong: But really like that’s never happened to me. And then, the guy it’s happened to get really tense and I’ll just say, “Okay, if you think ‘That’s not me,’ you just haven’t had it yet. So, get that smug look off your face and write this down, you’re going to need it.” And it’s so funny because the gray-haired guys just crack up and bald-head guys just relax and they sit up straight again and they look around at the young guys like, “Yeah, you’ll get there. Don’t worry.”
And the thing that I encourage people to do that I just want to offer listeners is have a plan B. And if you have a plan B for satisfying her and you know you have a plan B, she knows you have a plan B, she knows you’re in charge of calling when plan B is necessary, don’t make her ask for plan B because she doesn’t want to make you feel bad that you’re not at attention the way you normally are – you know you’re not. So, don’t try to make something work that’s not going to work. Just go to plan B, be proactive about it. And if you guys both know that you have a way of satisfying her no matter what and that you get to win because you satisfied her one way or another, then she doesn’t have to tone down her desire.
And what we’ve seen is by her not having to tone down her desire, plan B becomes less necessary.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right. Plan B suddenly becomes plan A. Or, it’s something – a beautiful space that they get to share that is like you were saying…
Alison Armstrong: Yeah, she doesn’t have to worry about he’s going to feel bad because he can’t satisfy her. She already knows, “No matter what, he’s going to satisfy me,” so she can be, “Oh man, honey, I’m so horny.” Then he’s like “Really?”
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right. Well, and I think it’s contributing to this positive cycle that you’re describing. If people are focusing on what’s the benefit long term if we’re sexually investing and engaging in our lovemaking, and we’re making time for that and we’re working together to share and not – then there’s ways to, like you’re describing all these different ways to support that process, then it’s not just like elusive, uncertain. It’s going to happen. It’s not binary like is it going to happen or is it not going to happen, and you were mentioning emotions too and the rejection.
I think it just supports people in a positive cycle that allows them creativity and less pressure and more for connection. And I think it’s a motivator because if you’re focusing on what it’s going to provide and there’s many avenues to get there, then I think it’s a little more inspiring. I feel so much more hopeful talking about that.
Alison Armstrong: Yeah. I’m glad – thank you for getting it. And I know it fits with what you’re working on and it would be irresponsible for me to not add that there are so many instincts in place that will prevent couples from implementing this. Like for example, what men do instinctively is conceal their desire until they’re sure she wants to.
And the more emotionally involved they are, the more careful he is because the more devastating being turned down is. And so he’ll be watching her for signs that she wants sex before he asks for it even before he asks to schedule a time where then she could then take care of herself so she wants to.
I know this from working with this with my husband, like just ask me for when, I will give you a when. You’re never going to be able to guess my schedule. You’re never going to be able to guess my energy levels. Just ask me for a date and I will make a date with you. And he says, “Well, but what if when we get to the date, you don’t want to have sex?” And I said, “I promise if the idea of having sex with you makes me want to cry, I will tell you.” And he’s like, “Really?” And then he says, “What if we get there and I don’t want to have sex?” “That’s fine. We don’t have to.” “But if we don’t have a time we set aside to do that, we’re never going to.”
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right.
Alison Armstrong: And that’s what finally got through to him, like “Never is not an option. Okay, I will ask you for a time.”
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes. And so the implementation of that, is it just open dialogue to really make it safe to ask?
Alison Armstrong: Well, I just want your listeners to know it will be a victory of human spirit to reach out to each other to say, when would be a good time to have sex or when would it be good to have naked time? And you just got to know both ways it’s very risky. It doesn’t matter how long you’ve been together. And so yes, kindness is good. Keeping your word is good.
An interesting thing is accountability is a really strange thing to bring into sex, but it’s still important. And what that means is, so let’s say that it’s time, you said, “All right, 9:00 tonight.” And now it’s 9:02. And one of you isn’t there. So now what? Does one of you wait in bed with your feelings hurt? Do you go get your partner? I work really hard all day and then I’m addicted to television. And so I just want to watch one more episode, right? I’ve got Netflix.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right.
Alison Armstrong: One more episode, one more episode. And the little – the leisure part of my brain is watching the clock and thinking, “We could slip one more episode in. And even though it’s 32 minutes and it’s a quarter to nine,” and then God bless him, Greg shows up at 9:00 and he’s like, “I believe we have a date.” And all of a sudden, he is like his love for me, his affection, his enthusiasm, who cares about television? I just turn the TV off and get up. I have fallen down and I can’t get up until he shows up and wants me and demands that I keep a date with him, and then I’m so excited.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: I love it.
Alison Armstrong: I’m so excited– yeah. You want me? Well, of course I’m there. Where if he didn’t show up I would start to feel rejected…
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right. Why didn’t he come get me?
Alison Armstrong: Exactly. Why didn’t he come get me? He asked for this date. Why isn’t he picking me up? I got to meet him there, he should be picking me. We had our 23-year anniversary on Saturday, you’d think I’d have a more mature conversation, especially since I’ve been involved in the transformation for 35 years. But I’m still human and so is everybody, and so is your partner. They’re still human. And what if we didn’t take that personally?
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right. I love it. So, I’m also thinking as you’re talking, I know women there’s a lot about the differences in the female brain. They’ll say that the man’s neural pathways for sex far exceed women’s, and then they also talk about how the connection for sex or the desire for sex can be very apparent in their sexual desires. It doesn’t have to be connected to all these other things, where women, the emotions are really connected to their sexual desire and wanting to be sexual – can you speak to that at all, like the interactions that might happen during the day that I think many women like John Gottman says, “Every positive interaction is foreplay.” And I think a lot of women endorse that. Do you have any thoughts on that?
Alison Armstrong: Oh, boy, I have so many thoughts as to what you were talking about. One is that as men get older and their testosterone levels naturally decline, their brains start making connections between different parts. And so, that pure physical desire in their youth, it changes, and it’s something that we need to know about them. And if for example a woman does something that has a man experience being disrespected, then that will kill his sexual desire unless he’s a really unhealthy man in which case he ends up being someone who gets arrested.
So for most men, disrespect will kill their sex drive. And women disrespect men all the time without even realizing that they are because for example we interrupt men a lot especially when they’re talking and we can grab in a conversation. We don’t know we just interrupted them.
And so it’s not just women who have emotions involved in sex, and if a woman is really shutting out a man sexually, the odds are pretty high that there’s something he did that hurt her feelings and she hasn’t been healed. And men have a greater ability to let certain things go and they wonder why women never let anything go. And it’s not immaturity; it’s not personal; it’s how we’re affected. And so “I’m sorry I hurt your feelings” goes a long way to getting women out of the deficit and receptive to sex because when our feelings have been hurt and not recovered, we can’t share ourselves physically. We shut down.
Another thing that most women don’t know – most men and women don’t know is complaining. Complaining is the sex murderer. It is the drive-by shooter of sex, and it is the un-sexiest thing that any man or woman can do, is complain. And what it has to do with is that the things that we complain about have an element of powerlessness to it. We complain about the things that we don’t feel powerful enough to fix or at least powerful enough to fix with as little energy as we’re willing to spend like maybe wave a wand. And so when we’re complaining, we’re displaying powerlessness, which is un, un, un-sexy.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right.
Alison Armstrong: And there are men who come home from work and complain and then want to have sex. And they don’t know that they just literally shut down their woman’s shop.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right.
Alison Armstrong: It doesn’t matter what she did all day to be ready to have sex with you. You just wiped it all out. And you are the un-sexiest person ever. So, complaining is something we need to break ourselves a habit of. I did a tele-class called “The Cure for Complaining,” and it’s a really, really important thing to take care of for both men and women.
I have talked to so many women about what makes them feel safe. So, this is to that point of every good moment during the day. But I’ve talked to so many women about what makes them feel safe. I’ve talked to equal number of women about what is romantic to them, meaning what makes them want to have sex. The answers are exactly the same. Exactly, exactly the same. What has a woman feel safe is what has her when they have sex.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: That’s powerful.
Alison Armstrong: Yeah. And what has women feel safe is feeling connected. So, moments of positive interest, moments of positive attention, those are the greatest access to feeling like at a very primal level – “You’re paying attention to me, if a tiger came along you would save me. So I should have sex with you.” So yeah, it’s all about that attention, and guys, here’s a big tip for you: the written word has a tremendous impact on women. So, text her. Those little “XO’s, XO’s, thinking about you sweetie, remembering how beautiful you are,” So cool. Ladies, no, it’s not the text. It’s your voice. Your voice has such an impact on men. Leave a voicemail. “Hi, handsome. You sexy man. I was thinking about you.” Right?
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes.
Alison Armstrong: Bam!
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes, yes. My goodness, Alison, I feel like you are giving us a tremendous gift. And I also know people are going to be inspired to connect with you and want to learn from you. Can you share quickly just how people can reach you, connect with you – what’s the best way to have people find you?
Alison Armstrong: The best way is to go to understandmen.com, and there you will find our workshops, our recordings, our books. If you click on Free Stuff, it will say “Read,” “Watch,” or “Listen.” There’s hours and hours and hours of information on there. We’ve been doing this for 21 years. I started studying men 25 years ago, and there’s just a ton available, and we’ve tried to make everything as accessible as possible. Strongly recommend reading the “Queen’s Code.” It’s available on paperback, or there’s an e-book with videos that go with it at the queenscode.com. Men, it will help you understand what you’re dealing with with women, why they emasculate you, why they think they’re supposed to act like their girlfriend and when you’re not, you’re bad.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right.
Alison Armstrong: Yeah. And women, it’s the secret code to men, and how to admire and respect and treat them with love and dignity in their world, not in a woman’s world, and thereby get more of what you need from them than you can possibly imagine. They’re so for you. And if you don’t experience that, I want you to.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Right. Is that speaking to the title, the “Queen’s Code” like if you can understand the code, exponentially the level that you would engage and receive would be tremendous, is that – yeah.
Alison Armstrong: Yeah. It’s the secret code to being treated like a queen. It’s the secret code of communicating with men. And it’s a code of honor for women. We’re pretty down and dirty with men. We are. We don’t play fair, and we don’t think we should. We think they deserve some really rough treatment, and it’s all for misunderstanding them. It’s very sad.
I wrote that book to transform the way women relate to men, it was the whole point of our starting our workshops 21 years ago. It was to learn how to write that book.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Well, such great work in the world and I have a friend, Alison, who just recently took your Queen’s Code, I think workshop or seminar, and she is a consumer of a lot of personal growth and she’s like “I kid you not.” Alison, I’m sure, I bet you all of her reviews from men and women far exceed any other relationship expert. She’s like, “She is phenomenal,” and just went raving and raving about you. I really feel so honored to have you on the show and thank you for your time. I will put all of these links on the show notes, so everybody can have access to that very quickly.
Alison Armstrong: Thank you. It was great to be with you, and I love what you’re doing here. Thank you so much for doing it.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: I hope you have enjoyed this interview with Alison Armstrong. If you would like to have access to the links that she’s mentioned, you can go on to my website, drjessicahiggins.com, click on PODCAST, and you can find the most recent episode there at the top, and today’s episode is Episode 56. “Secrets to Sex Even When No One is in the Mood.”
I hope you’ll reach out to her and I hope you’ll just gain even more wisdom and knowledge from her. So, thank you again to Alison Armstrong for sharing her time with us today.
If you have a question that you would like me to speak to in an upcoming podcast, you can email me at [email protected], or you can click on CONTACT of my website – again that’s drjessicahiggins.com and click on CONTACT to find all the ways to reach me there. I look forward to hearing from you, and I look forward to resuming answering listeners’ questions next week. Until then, I hope you take great care.
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