ERP 169: What To Do When Depression Takes Hold In Your Relationship, with Dr. Susan Heitler
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Hi, thank you for joining today’s podcast episode. Today’s episode is 169, “What to do when depression takes hold in your relationship, with Dr. Susan Heitler.” Before we get started, I wanna just take a moment with you and just join in the intention of the Empowered Relationship Podcast, and that is for you to be better equipped, more prepared in handling relational challenged in the landscape of long-term intimacy, knowing we may be faced or confronted with difficulty at times, but ask us to grow, ask us to heal and develop ourselves as we develop the quality of our relationship… Setting our relationship up for success, as we tune into these topics and these discussions that, again, help us feel more prepared in navigating the tricky terrain of long-lasting intimacy.
To access today’s show notes, you can find that on my website, DrJessicaHiggins.com. Click on Podcast, and you can find all the latest episodes there at the top. Again, today’s episode is 169, “What to do when depression takes hold in your relationship, with Dr. Susan Heitler.” She offers a wealth of material, she’s giving you lots of links and websites, and again, I will have that all, for easy access, on the show notes.
Let’s get started in today’s episode.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Susan Heitler PhD is a Denver clinical psychologist and widely-read author. Educated at Harvard and NYU, Susan Heitler offers self-help information for individuals and for couples. Dr. Heitler also writes for therapists, offering new understandings and treatments for anxiety, anger, depression, narcissism, and relationship challenges. Dr. Heitler’s web-page provides an overview with links to 40+ years of books, blog posts, articles, podcasts, videos, webinars, online marriage education program, and more. Dr. Susan Heitler has earned a national and international reputation as one of America’s leading psychologists.
So excited to have you on this show, Dr. Heitler.
Dr. Susan Heitler: It is my pleasure, thank you!
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yay! Well, today’s topic is about depression, and also how it impacts couples. Before we get started, I’m hoping that perhaps you could tell us a little bit of your framework of how you see depression. I know there’s a lot of viewpoints out there.
Dr. Susan Heitler: Absolutely. Many people say depression is a chemical disorder; well, they’re right, there is a change in your internal chemistry; there’s also a change in your internal chemistry if you’re happy, if you’re angry. Emotions do get manifested in the body by physiological changes. At the same time, what triggers those changes is important. When someone smiles at you, that triggers the chemistry of happiness; when someone looks negatively at you, changes begin happening that move more toward the angry or depressive, negative emotional state.
Now, in particular, what triggers depression is feeling powerless or giving up on something you want. My quick definition of depression – depression is a disorder of power.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Wow, I love that. It’s so helpful. I watched a video of yours and you were talking about your Bump Model. Would you be willing to share a little bit about that? Because that’s really how to deal with this collapsing, folding and giving up on something that means something.
Dr. Susan Heitler: Okay. As you’re walking down the road of life, every so often you (everybody in the world, the generic you) are gonna hit a bump. What’s a bump? A problem, a dilemma, a conflict, an issue, a decision… One of those times where you can’t just keep going along the flow; you have to pause for a minute and react. Now, often the reaction will be negative; you’ll feel irritation, anxiety. Those are signs, “Oh, I’ve hit a bump”, initially. Then the question is where do you go from there.
If you put your hand in front of your face – just open up your hand and put it in front of your face; if you think of the bump as that slight lump at the base of your hand, at your wrist, where your hand and your arm meet. From that point, there’s four different roads – a thumb and four fingers. The first finger points toward anger. When you hit a bump, you can get mad at someone; you can blame them, you can try to dominate them to get what you want… That’s the anger road, the bite road.
If you’re not a fighter, you might fold. Well, giving up on what you want… “Hey, just do it your way, no problem” – there are times when that’s actually a good solution, but for the most part, folding leads to depression. So that’s the road we’re mostly focused on today, the fold road.
Now, I do wanna say that if you’re a little monkey playing in the jungle and you see a banana, you’re gonna run over and get it, until you see a big gorilla coming for the same bananas. You know what – folding may be a good idea. There’s no animal hospitals in the jungle; injuries are bad. It’s the same for people. If you see someone who has clearly more power than you, you may be better off giving up than getting into a fight.
Now, you may decide “I don’t wanna give up, I don’t wanna fight, so I’m just not gonna deal with it.” That’s a freeze response. Freeze usually perpetuates anxiety. You’re anxious, because you know you want that banana and you’re really hungry, and at the same time, it’s too dangerous to try to grab the banana; “What will I do, what will I do?” That’s a state of anxiety, and what freezes is your thinking. So you look like you’re moving, you’re walking, you’re talking, but your problem-solving has frozen, so the problem stays there, and you keep feeling anxious.
Okay, we have the recipes for fight, fold and freeze. What about the baby finger? The baby finger is “Flee! Monkey, get out of there!” Now, sometimes we freeze physically, sometimes we flee mentally… Like, if we stop out at the bar, we’ll be distracted, we’ll good chemically, and we’ll forget about the problem. All four of those finger pathways go to negative reactions on the whole. So let’s drop those four actions, and say “Hey, wait, I really don’t wanna be depressed.” There are techniques that you can pump yourself up, so you actually don’t even feel depressed; you feel powerful again. You can use that technique, and once you feel powerful enough, go back and readdress the problem, the bump. Then, if you take the thumb road, hopefully you’ll come up with a good solution.
Now, if you’re part of a couple and the bump was something that happened between you and your partner, then in order to take the thumb road you really need pretty good skills. Skills for what? Skills for saying what your concerns are, skills for hearing the other person’s concerns without getting defensive, and skills for win/win problem-solving. Those are the skills I teach on my website, and my book, and the blogs etc.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Nice.
Dr. Susan Heitler: If you take the thumb route, if you put your hand in front of you, where does that thumb route go? It goes up to feeling good again, and you circle around in the world of well-being, in the world of warmth, affection and a positive relationship.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: I love that. I love even the somatic tool to be able to access that very easily, and the thumbs up just feels good.
Dr. Susan Heitler: Excellent.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Okay, so this is really helpful to really access some simple, fundamental, but not easy at all strategy; in your video you call it prescription, that it’s this way of identifying the bump, and then being able to pump up… There’s more description for listeners if you wanna hear her story that she shares about a client that she was working with in this way, and also from that new, more empowered place, being able to address the bump more skillfully. I really encourage people to check that video.
Dr. Susan Heitler: That’s either on my TEDx talk on YouTube – if you google my name, “Susan Heitler” and the word “depression”, hopefully that will pop up. And then there’s another case that I have a video of, on the PrescriptionsWithoutPills.com website. That’s a free website with videos, also on depression and other issues.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Wonderful. I’ll make sure to post those links to today’s show notes for easy access.
Dr. Susan Heitler: Excellent. My hunch is you would like to talk about what goes on in couples in depression.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Absolutely. If you could talk a little bit about what people typically experience in relationship when one partner is dealing with depressive symptoms, because as you’ve even mentioned, when couples are together and they’re looking at each other, and you’re saying “Right, if one person’s down, and looking down, or just even that non-verbal, that can be difficult.” I even have a listener’s question that I would love to read at some point, but I would love to just get the lay of the land around what you see when couples are dealing with depression.
Dr. Susan Heitler: Right. The word depression refers to a whole, long continuum, from feeling down, kind of blues, to being so powerless, no batteries, you can barely get out of bed. If people are on the extreme end of powerlessness, depression, so much negative thinking that god forbid they’re even thinking about suicide, it’s really important that they get not only professional help, a psychotherapist, but also a psychiatrist or a physician that prescribes medication.
Medication is essential for the extreme end, and it’s way over-prescribed for the earlier ends. To hear more about my concerns about depression, you can look, again, at the YouTube video, or other things that I’ve written.
The bottom line though is good news, which is with most depression, if you can figure out the trigger, whether it’s your depression or your spouse’s depression, your partner’s depression, if you can together figure out what that trigger was, what’s the problem, what’s the bump you’ve hit, then you can take a deep breath, feel yourself getting bigger, and then start talking together or on your own about what are some options to dealing with that situation. Think about what are your concerns in this situation, to share a lot about the situation, and then begin brainstorming on what are some solution options. Even the process of taking that deep breath so that you feel more pumped up works rather amazingly to help you begin to feel better.
I’ll give you a little trick. Stand up… I guess if you’re driving as you listen to this you can’t stand up, but if you’re in a private place, stand up and take a power pose. Feel those flexed muscles, pump your chest out… Oh, notice how much more energized you feel. A few deep breaths in that power pose… Oh, you get out of that slump, and into being an energized person. Well, it turns out you can think both about what the problem was, and about what to do about it much more effectively if you feel re-empowered.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes. And just for the listeners – because I’m with you, I watched your videos, I’ve been looking at your articles… But is there anything that a listener could — maybe if you have a story, or an example that could help people identify a little bit more practically?
Dr. Susan Heitler: With a postpartum depression… She was just too damned to even wanna take care of that beautiful little new baby. So she came in for a session, and I said “Close your eyes.” The first question to pinpoint what the problem is is “If you’re gonna be mad at someone, a little irritated or really angry, anywhere along that annoyed continuum, notice who comes up on your visual screen. Not yourself. Someone other than yourself. Or maybe some thing. What do you see?” The postpartum woman saw two things, actually; first she saw her husband, and then she saw the baby, so he took them one by one.
When you see your husband, fill in the picture of what’s going on, and notice what you want. “Well, he’s reading the newspaper, and I’m exhausted, and I want him to pitch in, help out; there’s dishes all over the countertop… I don’t even have the energy to make some supper, never mind clean up afterwards… I want him to pitch in.” Oh. Okay, now we’ve identified what goes on. Because I ask “Well, how would that scene end, usually?” “Well, I just push myself till I do it, because I know he really wants to read the paper, and he keeps saying he’s so stressed from work.” Okay, we pinpointed the problem. That’s the first P.
The second P of three is to Pump up. Just like we just pumped up by standing up in a power pose, you can do that visually. Keeping your eyes closed, picture yourself growing bigger. Whoops, I’ve skipped one step. Once you’ve pinpointed the problem, as yourself “Who looks bigger – me or the other?” That’s a test for depression, and a test for whether you’ve pinpointed the right situation. If you look small and he looks big, you’ve hit the right situation; you’re depressed.
Okay, so then the instruction for pumping up is take a deep breath and picture yourself getting big… Bigger… Bigger… Take another deep breath until you’re significantly bigger than the person you’re mad at, or the situation. Once you are pumped up, then you can ask yourself “So what could I do that would be a different way to handle the situation?” What did that woman come up with? She said, “Well, I’ve been just walking around, feeling really angry at my husband… But I don’t wanna start a fight, so I didn’t bark at him like I wanted to, or punch him in the nose like I really would have wanted to… So I just didn’t say anything.” Oh…
When you’re bigger, how could you talk with [unintelligible 00:18:13.04] more effective. She thought for a minute, and she said, “Well, maybe I could say that I’m totally overwhelmed.” Oh, that’s better than “You never do anything. You think you are stressed…” And that might have been my tendency in the past, or else to say nothing. I can see, if I just explain to him how I’m just so exhausted; our baby gets up like five times a night, and I had him in the middle of the night, so I missed that night of sleep, and I just am exhausted.” If I explained that to him, maybe he’d respond; I don’t know.” Oh… And if he didn’t respond, what would you do then? She said “You know, I’d say again, I really need your help. How would you feel about… And we’d talk about what are some things he could do to pitch in. If that didn’t work, maybe I’d call his mother, and talk with her, and ask her what to do.” [unintelligible 00:19:28.08] generating ideas.
Okay, so now she had some thoughts, and I asked her “How are you feeling now?” “Well, actually, I don’t feel totally like myself. I do feel if I keep picturing myself big like that, and picture myself doing something to get the help I need, I feel much better.” Shall I tell you what actually happened?
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Mm-hm.
Dr. Susan Heitler: She went home, she started talking with him, and he said “I just can’t do those things you’re asking me. How about if I look online and see if we could hire someone, at least for a couple days, to do the housework and help you with the baby?” She said, “Sold. It’s a deal.” [laughter] They got help, and after several days it was a whole different ball game.
[unintelligible 00:20:26.06] her anger at the baby. When she closed her eyes and pictured the baby screaming and screaming, guess who looked bigger? The baby looked huge, like a monster, and she looked small, like a teeny little girl. She was totally overwhelmed. We did the same process, and the image of what would be helpful was “I need help. Whether it’s from hiring someone for a few days, calling my mother, his mother, getting more help…” And the more help she got, the more she began to really love that baby.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: So powerful. I love it, because this is something I imagine that when people can utilize in practice more, it can apply to any area, if people have had a — you know, if you’re resorting back to the kind of tendencies people have with the model of the hand when there is a bump, that there’s usually typical tendencies people have… So if people tend to fold because they don’t feel like they have that confidence, helping them build that confidence and feeling more pumped up, to be more proactive…
Dr. Susan Heitler: Yeah. So that brings us to the question of — like we talked a little earlier, “What’s the nature of depression, or do you know it is really depression?” One test that therapists use is to look for negative thinking. There’s three realms where you might find your thinking is much more negative than it normally is. Negative thoughts about yourself, negative thoughts about others, like in this case about the baby, and negative thoughts about her husband. “He’s so lazy! He’s so selfish!”, all those thoughts were going through her head… And negative thoughts about the situation. “This is hopeless. Why did I ever have a baby that was so dumb?” etc.
So if you’re having what’s called the negative cognitive triad, negative thoughts about self, other or the situation — oh, or the future… I guess the situation maybe goes into self and others, so the third piece of the negative cognitive triad is negative thoughts about the future. “It’s never going to get any better.” So when you see that “Yes, this is depression”, you can spring into action with the three P’s visualization.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes. And I’m curious when couples are dealing with depression, and the partner that is in relationship to the partner who does have depression – I’m just wondering, is there a place where someone gets burnt out, where they’re offering empathy, or ideas, or encouragement, or positive feedback, but the person who’s depressed, if it lasts for a period of time, I feel like couples sometimes get challenged, and then if the person who is depressed isn’t necessarily in a place where they’re getting help or they’re shifting their pattern… What do you see?
Dr. Susan Heitler: Well, one direction someone like that might go is actually self-examination. Here’s why – most depression is triggered by what goes on in our most important relationship. Oops, that’s me, and you… So then, if your partner is depressed, you might ask yourself, “I wonder if there’s something that I’ve been doing which is making me seem to him/her more powerful. Have I been taking a dominant position? Have I really been listening, or am I always telling him or her what to do? Am I assuming my way is the right way, I know best…?” So do a little self-examination there. That’s for starters.
Second thing, depression is a very serious phenomenon. Get help. Make sure you’re getting professional help. If the professional help isn’t helping, get or encourage your partner to get someone else. Don’t stay with a therapist who’s not helping, unless they’re helping somewhat and it does seem like it’s going in the right direction.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Gotcha.
Dr. Susan Heitler: Do you want another thing?
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Mm-hm.
Dr. Susan Heitler: Googling. There’s so much good information now on the web about things you can do.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Great. Did you wanna say one other thing, or…?
Dr. Susan Heitler: Well, I was gonna say this… A lot of self-help things you can do for depression, and if you’re the partner of someone who’s depressed, you could do them together. For instance, sunshine is a great antidote for depression. Go take a walk outside. Music – another natural antidote. Put on some really peppy music, or whatever music feels like an anti-depressant to the depressed person.
Third, get outdoors to see green, as well as to get sunlight. The natural greenery of outdoors is an anti-depressant. Fourth – activity. Almost any activity pumps you up; it literally pumps up your system. So instead of your batteries being low, you’ve plugged into activity to re-energize yourself.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes, thank you.
Dr. Susan Heitler: You are very welcome.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Is it okay if I read a listener’s question that I think deals with — in your article, “Five realities about depression that make it highly contagious”…
Dr. Susan Heitler: Oh, yes. I wrote that a long time ago. I’m curious to know what I wrote.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: [laughs] Right, I know. That happens to me, too.
Dr. Susan Heitler: Well, so one of the comments or one of the things you identified was negative energy, and that when your partner is down, that again, the mirror neurons – looking at your partner and they’re really down, and it can have an effect, as you were talking about… So this one listener – I’ll just do an excerpt; she’s saying she’s been listening to the podcast, really trying to implement a lot… Her and her partner have been together for nine years. She says:
“One aspect I’ve been struggling with is when my partner is in a bad mood, he is often quite moody and very up and down. I find it frustrating and feel quite on edge around him. When I confront him and ask him what is wrong, he usually just shrugs it off and says he’s fine, which usually pushes me away and makes me feel quite helpless and shut down. Lately, I’ve been trying really hard to not let his moods affect me, but it is very difficult.”
Is there anything you might be able to say to this listener, who’s challenged with this dynamic?
Dr. Susan Heitler: Number one, I like that the listener — she or he…?
Dr. Jessica Higgins: She.
Dr. Susan Heitler: She wants to be helpful. She might ask “What helps and what doesn’t help?” For instance, for some people, particularly men, when they are in a bad mood, they like to go to their cave; that was the contribution of “Men are from Mars”, John Gray. So it may be good for her and for him, “Hey, I think I’m gonna go out for a walk, or go to the gym. I’m hoping you’ll feel better by the time I get back.” At least then you’ve re-energized yourself. So let him join your mood, instead of you joining his mood, and doing one of those things that are natural anti-depressants; something that you enjoy doing – sunshine, activity etc. so that you’re in a good mood. It is important.
Separate yourself a little bit from him, to let your emotional state be positive, even if he’s down. It’s all the more important if his depression is coming out as irritability and anger – don’t sit and take it; just excuse yourself, go do something else… Because people who are depressed are at risk for higher irritability. That’s what can create a depression in the partner as well – being put down, being criticized, being blamed, being spoken to in a negative voice; then negative energy will come into you, and you don’t want that.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes… Thank you. There’s a second question here, and she says “I think I have an unhealthy attachment style and a fear of abandonment”, and she is wondering about the dynamic of her chasing him, and him avoiding… Is that something that you can speak to at all?
Dr. Susan Heitler: Yes. The alternative to pursuing and avoiding is to come together and feel safe talking about what’s going on. Being in a partnership – and marriage all the more so – is a highly skilled activity. It’s for adults, not people who inside feel like children, although everyone from time to time may feel a little childlike… For the most part, the more you feel “Oh, I’m a grown-up, I can take care of things”, this is better, but also, grown-ups have skills. So where do you get the skills? Of course, I like my version of them, and I know different people learn in different ways, so that’s why I’ve written the book “The Power of Two”, “The Power of Two Workbook”, a website, PowerOfTwoMarriage.com… We tried to get PowerOfTwo.com, but that was already owned by a Christian rock band… [laughter] So PowerOfTwoMarriage.com is for any couple – they don’t have to be married; it teaches the same skills as the book and the workbook, only via fun exercises and videos and little worksheets that you can download as PDFs. There’s podcasts on my TherapyHelp.com website, click Podcasts… A podcast called “Depression: A disorder of power.” And then another podcast called Conflict Resolution For Couples.
When couples have good skills for talking over what’s going on, for talking over where an offset might have happened makes all the difference. Nobody has to pursue, no one has to distance… You can really talk over what’s happening and feel better, as a team.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes. And just even what you’ve said in today’s episode about being able to really come from a place of listening, and also feeling equal power, being aware of that, and if you’re feeling less than, maybe do that pump up… And really creating that safe space together and then utilizing these skills of communication. It’s fabulous. Okay, so you have much more to offer, and I know that one episode is not gonna cover everything… I guess the last thing I wanna just offer – is there anything you wanna say on this topic, that we haven’t already discussed?
Dr. Susan Heitler: I think I would say there are many treatments for depression. So if you’re depressed, don’t be passive about it. Just like if you had a really bad cough and your chest was hurting, you would do something about it. Maybe get at least a few hours extra sleep… And sleep, by the way, is another good anti-depressant, sometimes, for brief periods of depression. You wake up the next morning, “Oh, I feel a lot better.” So start by taking care of yourself in simple ways… But depression is serious; get more help. See a therapist as a next step. Read books. There’s a number of exercises you can do in my book called prescriptions without pills. You can find that, again, on the PrescriptionsWithoutPills.com website. There’s lots you can do. If those and/or a psychotherapist aren’t doing it, only at that point do you wanna begin taking medication.
The difficulty, I’ll say briefly, is that the medications are not addictive in that they don’t cause a craving. They are like addictive in that they make your body drug-dependent. So if you’ve been on anti-depressants for more than a couple months, your body forgets how to make the normal happy chemicals. That means that when you stop taking the anti-depressants, you may crash into a depression not be because it’s been there all along, but because your body forgot how to be normal… So sometimes the anti-depressants are a life-saver, but try other options first, and do something about it. Take good care of yourself.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Yes… Wonderful. Well, Dr. Susan Heitler, you’ve mentioned several links; I will make sure to put that all in the show notes, so people can find your resources on those websites. Is there a way that you would encourage people how to contact you or how to get in touch with your work?
Dr. Susan Heitler: Another fact just occurred to me.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Okay.
Dr. Susan Heitler: If you go for depression to a therapist, bring your partner along… Because if you have a little bit of a hunch that maybe it’s your interactions that are the problem, it’s really important that you both be in couple therapy, not that you try to fix it alone. That’s a big mistake that many people make. Be a team, go to therapy from the outset together; and even if your partner isn’t part of the problem, [unintelligible 00:35:26.26] they may be a part of the solution.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Well said, well said.
Dr. Susan Heitler: And what else did you ask – is there anything else…?
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Well, I wanna know – you’ve listed a lot of links that I’ll make sure to put on the show notes… Is there any way that you would recommend people get in contact with you and your work most? Or just what you’ve already referenced.
Dr. Susan Heitler: Oh, if you go to my blog on PsychologyToday.com, I have actually close to 300 little, short blog pieces there. So if they scroll down and find what’s there, that can be helpful. Also, they’re welcome to write to me from there, or from either my therapyhelp.com website, or PrescriptionsWithoutPills.com website… And I’m glad for people to send their questions or comments.
If I can ask their help – I’ve been hit by trolls on my TEDx talk.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Oh, no…
Dr. Susan Heitler: A huge number of negative comments. If you’ve found this helpful as you’ve been listening, I would be so appreciative, if you find the talk that I’ve given there helpful, if you write something positive; anything positive. Or a question. I would be so appreciative. I respond right away to people there.
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Okay. Well, Dr. Heitler, I will be one of those people posting something positive. I appreciate your contribution and your research and all that you offer through your books, blogs, videos and programs. Thank you for your time today, I really appreciate it.
Dr. Susan Heitler: And thank you so much for contacting me. This has been delightful
Dr. Jessica Higgins: Oh, good!
I hope you have enjoyed today’s episode, again, with Dr. Susan Heitler. I had a chance to look at her comments on her video which she was describing having some negative feedback, and the gist of what I got… I didn’t read all of them by any means, but what I was gathering – people were commenting around how much pain and how serious depression is, and that they felt as though perhaps her prescription, her model doesn’t actually deal with that significant level of pain; that’s it’s too simple.
As Dr. Susan Heitler encouraged, if someone’s experiencing the more severe symptoms of depression – suicidal ideation and really having a real difficulty functioning, going to work, going to school, engaging in relationship and self-care, just even the sleeping and the eating, and those types of things, it’s incredibly important to get help; medication, therapy, and multiple avenues for getting support.
While I can appreciate that on face value it may not seem that her teaching addresses that severe depression — there are a couple things I wanna say about this. As she mentioned in today’s episode, there is a bit of a continuum when we’re talking about depression and depressive symptoms, and depression is often a common experience. I remember once a professor said “Depression is a natural reaction to an upsetting situation.” Now, we probably all can remember a time where we felt down, and disempowered, and wanted to fold, as Dr. Heitler is talking about, and yet the people that are commenting are saying “Severe depression is not that.” Understood. Absolutely. And at the same time, what happens is when we have a chronic tendency to dealing with difficulty, and the neurochemical effect and the physiological change that it can occur in us, it can be incredibly debilitating, and feeling very powerless, and has so many effects on us… So there’s no argument in that at all.
At the same time, when Dr. Susan Heitler is doing a teaching, on a TED talk, for example, it’s important to distill complex ideas and constructs into really practical tools. And her three-step prescription model to dealing with depression, again, might seem simple, but I do believe it’s extremely powerful. There’s a physiological, somatic component in number two, pump up, with the breathing, and your posture, and that that actually has a lot of impact on our experience. There’s a lot of research to support that. And number one, just recognizing the narrative, the inner story, and how we are in that story; what role we play in that story.
This is really addressing more of the cognitive, the narrative part of our processing, and it’s much deeper than what I’m trying to even describe right now. And number three, the problem-solving is very solution-based, it’s very proactive, it’s empowerment, as we can recognize some options that we have to address our situation.
I do believe that over time, if one was to use Dr. Susan Heitler’s prescription, her Bump Model, as a tool, perhaps with a therapist, the significant other, or even a multi-pronged approach, that her prescription would provide some guidance, and that again, over time, with practice, with iteration, this would then help someone be able to shift their tendency from folding and giving up on something that matters that they would love, to feeling empowered, and being able to address difficult situations. In my mind, that’s extremely transformational.
One final note – often times when something is seemingly simple, as I mentioned, it can be very complex in nature, and the application of it; just because it’s easy to understand doesn’t mean it’s easy to implement. And in my mind, this is often a sign of someone who has developed a certain level of mastery. I think this is one of the things why Steve Jobs with Apple was so successful – he was able to take a very complex device and process, and make it extremely user-friendly and very simple.
I wanna encourage you that if you’ve found some resonance with something that Dr. Susan Heitler had to offer today, to perhaps not judge it on face value; that it didn’t seem to resonate or capture the significance or the severity of what you might be feeling if you are challenged with depression, or your significant other is depressed… I wanna just invite you to look at the practice of it, and possibly try it out. I wanna just encourage you to experiment with whatever principles are offered on this show. Again, they are suggestions for you to practice and experiment with, and if you give it a try and you find some value, then perhaps you can incorporate it into your tool bag.
Again, if you would like access to today’s show notes, you can visit DrJessicaHiggins.com, click on Podcast, and you can find all the episodes there. Today’s episode, again, is 169, “What to do when depression takes hold in your relationship, with Dr. Susan Heitler.”
Thank you for listening, and until next time, take great care.
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